Big Paws Only Dog Forums
Newfoundlands => Newfoundland Discussions => : newflvr December 12, 2006, 07:17:18 AM
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I got an email last night that Grizzley/Izzy is going to have to go back to rescue. The wonderful family that took him live/run a fabulous (especially for a Newf!!) Christian camp and they just found out that they won't be able to have insurance if they have a dog because of the fear of a dog biting (it wasn't directed at Izzy personally!!). I'm just so, SO sad! I know how much they love Izzy and how settled Izzy was getting! I've suggested that they try getting him tested for therapy work so he'll be insured, but haven't heard anything back.Â
Maybe if we all cross our fingers, something will work out, otherwise, Izzy will be back in rescue for Christmas! :'(
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that is sad. Insurance companies can be too picky. i'm sure he won't stay in rescue very long. a sweet fuzzy face like that will get him taken home soon i'm sure.
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has the dog had any history of biting? Or is it just the insurance company being idiots as usual?
cuz that really sucks if it is just the insurance company
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a lot of insurance companies are paranoid about these things. try finding an apartment or a rental house with rotts. it ain't easy.
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I've never had a problem with a single rott, Theres one at our local humane society that i walked today with my wife she was an angel, her old owner's landlord didnt want a rott because they're 'Dangerous' . once again some people really do suck
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rental companies, etc? we just BOUGHT our house, have inside ONLY dogs, and our insurance company just dropped us like a hot potato, no biting history, no aggression, NOTHING! they justified it strictly because of breeds.
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It's just the insurance company...Izzy, from everything she said, is perfect!!
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OMG this is so so sad!! :'( Hopefully they can find an insurance company that will work with them, or something happens to where they can keep adorable Izzy. Fingers, toes and paws crossed that everything works out!
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This is so depressing. I'm keeping everything crossed that they find an insurance provider and Izzy gets to stay in his home.
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This is very sad news. My thoughts are with Izzy and her for now family. Insurance. BLAH!!!!
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Oh, I just read this post. How frustrating and unfair. >:( OK, so I just deleted this HUGE rant about liability and avoiding responsibility, etc. It's just too much to get into here, and something that really gets to me (The fact that everything in life now has a waiver or requires insurance, etc). I hope they find a way to work things out so that Izzy can stay. My thoughts are with them.
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i know USAA and state farm work with large breed / bad rep. dogs
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This is so sad. He was so happy there and even if he finds a good home. What about The ones who adopted him? I feel so bad for them.
If he was a therapy dog, could he be part of the therapy too? Wonder what the insurance company would say about that. If they don't own the camp, they may have no choice. Can they have dogs at all?
This really sucks just before Christmas.
My thoughts are with them. Wish they lived on this side of the US.
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He could do therapy work (i.e., visiting hospitals, schools, assisted living facitilites, etc) and I'm sure he'd be great at it. Newfs seem to be naturals at giving love and comfort.
I haven't heard any more from her so I'm not too sure what the latest is in regards to moving him back to his foster home!
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We had dobies for years (one of the tops on the insurance ban list) and never heard a peep out of our insurance company. We started with State Farm and now have Allstate. I think that it so sucks that an insurance company can control our lives to that extent. But look at HMOs, they control your very life.
Stella
our insurance company come out within 2 months, and dropped us less than 30 days later
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When I asked about Izzy being a therapy dog yesterday, I was thinking more along the lines of working at the camp. He would then be an employee and part of the program there. If the insurance company then refused that would put them in a bad light. Better yet they shouldn't or couldn't dicate the work that is being done there. As pet he is a liablity, as a therapy dog involved in the program, he is an asset and deserves their protection also.
Just a thought.
Skippy
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I noticed that someone already mentioned USAA. I know that there used to be issues with getting insured if you weren't military, but I think that has been lifted now. I have a rotti, and could not rent anywhere here because of breed laws. We ended up having to buy, and when I called USAA I was scared that they would have an issue with him. They asked if I had a dog, and when I said yes and that he was a rotti, the lady went into a 10 min praise fest about how much she loved that breed and wished she could have one. They had no concerns at all and we haven't heard a peep from them regarding it since.
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This is SO sad and unfair. Have they spoken to other insurance companies? I know that Allstate and State Farm (I believe) deems all dogs equally capable of biting. I'm sure the insurance would be a bit higher, but at least they could keep Izzy!!!!
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When I asked about Izzy being a therapy dog yesterday, I was thinking more along the lines of working at the camp. He would then be an employee and part of the program there. If the insurance company then refused that would put them in a bad light. Better yet they shouldn't or couldn't dicate the work that is being done there. As pet he is a liablity, as a therapy dog involved in the program, he is an asset and deserves their protection also.
Just a thought.
Skippy
Great idea! Hopefully Galaxe (Jessica) is following this thread because there are many great ideas (and support!!) for keeping Izzy right there where he belongs!!
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It sounds like Izzy is just too great a fit for them to let go!!!
EXACTLY! I hope that they are able to work something out. How sad. :(
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I wish I had some helpful thoughts. How sad! I know they were so excited about Izzy and it seemed like such an awesome fit for everyone. :'( I too think I'd consider other companies. While I'd normally not consider a broker, this might be an excellent way to go. You never know, a broker might even be able to get them lower rates. Ok, maybe far fetched but I'm an optimist.
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I noticed that someone already mentioned USAA. I know that there used to be issues with getting insured if you weren't military, but I think that has been lifted now. I have a rotti, and could not rent anywhere here because of breed laws. We ended up having to buy, and when I called USAA I was scared that they would have an issue with him. They asked if I had a dog, and when I said yes and that he was a rotti, the lady went into a 10 min praise fest about how much she loved that breed and wished she could have one. They had no concerns at all and we haven't heard a peep from them regarding it since.
they're offering to cover us with (we had to give tiny away since, but...) 2 pitbulls, 1 akita, 1 akita chow and a great dane, with NO problems, as long as i continued to keep them inside and they weren't running the neighborhood (and they said this was said only because of the # of dogs we had)
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Daphne,
Yep, our broker got us *much* lower rates when ours went through the roof. This was on health insurance (it went up 23% this year!) and we got a better plan for less money. Can you imagine that?!? We were thrilled.
Julie
Ok, so we all need to get on praying and/or thinking positive thoughts that they can find another company that will insure them with Izzy with lower rates!
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Hey guys. Thank you for all of the kind words and support. Admittedly, I've been a bit afraid of posting our problem, since I was embarrassed to be one of "those people" who has to give up their animals. I never imagined that life could put us into this position.
For a little more clarification, it's not that we can't get an insurance company to cover Izzy. It's that we can't find an insurance company that will cover the camp as an insured in the event of Izzy biting. Our renter's insurance will allow us a 300,000 personal liability policy in the event that Izzy were to bite someone (anyone who has spent more than 30 seconds can tell you that would never happen). However, the policy will not cover the camp if someone decides to sue them. Because we live on the camp grounds (right smack dab in the middle at that), the camp faces litigation if Izzy bites, and since the camp's liability insurance will not cover Izzy, any litigation would be straight from the camp's pockets. And, for any of those who have worked for a nonprofit- that is just money that the camp doesn't have. Or couldn't even come up with, short of selling the camp.
We have looked into different policies that will cover the camp in the event that Izzy does bite, but have not found anything that is not exorbitantly expensive (thousands a month. Nonprofit salaries just don't cover that.) Right now we are at our wit's ends at the thoughts of losing our baby. We can't even move, as part of Sean's job description requires us to live on camp most of the time. We are looking into the potential of getting Izzy certified for therapy work, but I don't know that he can pass it yet, or that the insurance provided with TDI certification will cover the camp as well. It turns out that, about 15 years ago, the camp was sued over a dog bite by a staff member's malamute mix. The camp was part of a larger organization at that point and was able to stay standing when it was over. When we got Izzy, we communicated with all of the people that we needed to, but it turns out that none of them checked with the insurance company like they were supposed to. So, here we are...
Sorry that this is so long. Thank you once again for your continued advice and prayers!
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Jessica, please don't be embarrassed!!! One thing I've learned from this group is that there is not a single person here who hasn't been through rough times and it has made them all kind, compassionate and thoughtful. With all of us thinking this problem through, I'm sure we'll come up with some way to salvage the situation!
The important thing is that you want Izzy and Izzy is happy with you! We'll just brain-storm!!! You keep working on training! He'll be great...I just know it!
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Hi Jessica,
Just wondering how you are making out. Have you found any soloutions yet? There has to be one out there some where.
Wishing well
Skippy
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Sad news....Izzy/Grizzley is going back to rescue in the next week or two. Jessica and Sean are devastated, I know, but the board of the camp where they work are so frightened of the liablity of a dog! Apparently, Izzy/Grizzley is a talker. If you have never been around a 'talking' Newf, it does sound like growling, but it really is an attempt at communication with people. My first Newf, Otis 'talked': he'd watch my mouth when I was talking to him and he would attempt to mimic me. It really is the funniest thing! I guess Izzy does the same thing while wagging his tail and wiggling but it's given the wrong impression.
It just makes me SO frickin' angry that people are so afraid of being sued and of the hold insurance companies have on our lives. Izzy HASN'T bitten anyone, hasn't snapped or done anything to be rejected: but rejected he is!!
GRRRRRRRRRRRRR >:(
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so sad, my dogs all talk too, i love it and think it's sweet, but it does tend to scare people, even my family sometimes (the ones who don't live with us). so sad though.
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How sad! My heart goes out to Jessica and Sean, I can't imagine how upset they are. :'( Izzy sounds like the perfect dog.
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Dear Jessica and Sean,
My thoughts are with you. It is so sad to have the perfect friend and the world doesn't understand. Does this mean you can't have any kind of dog? If it does, it will take a great deal of fullfillment in your work to make up for the loss.
Wishing you could find a soloution. We know how much you cared.
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We did comtemplate hiding him, really, he's the exact same color as our carpet upstairs. If only he would hold still a little bit longer..
We looked into and considered TDI testing. The issue is that, though we love him so, our boy has some serious manners issues. The only command that he listens to 80% of the time is sit. Lay down? Forget it. Stay? Ha, you muct be joking. Also, he still has some fear aggression issues to be worked out with other dogs. He is fine with dogs under 35 pounds or so, but if the test calls for him to be introduced to a larger dog, well, that's it. The truth is that, sadly, while he more than certainly has the temperment to be a therapy dog, it will take quite some time to get his training completed to pass the test.
This whole issue has been heartbreaking, frustrating, maddening, and incredibly depressing. Every time I see him cuddled up on the floor with our 6 pound cat, or our friend's 18 month old (who he adores, and they are such partners in crime that it is hilarious) I just want to yell and scream "Does this look like a dangerous dog?"
I am trying to look at the positives, and the only thing I can find is that, perhaps this incident will prevent another dangerous one- ie, because we now know that the insurance will not cover a dog, there won't be any additional dogs at camp, and perhaps that limitation will prevent the camp from ever admitting a dog that would end up being dangerous.
But still, it's not fair. I want to pout like a little kid and clench my fists and scrunch up my face and make loud "hmph" noises. But, I know that won't do any good. Instead, I can only hope that Izzy finds a wonderful, wonderful family with lots of love to give him, and hopefully a couple of kids- he really, really likes them. For now, Sean and I will hopefully find a way to continue to be involved with Newf rescue, perhaps through transport or other avenues that don't include 130 pounds of love staying with us. And, as we begin to plan our house, look at propety, etc., we continue to keep in mind our future fur babies. And, by the way, when we do own our own house- we are having a Newf get together just to "nahnah" the board with our hoard of dangerous dogs.
No, we aren't able to have any kind of dog. The other family up here has a fully enclosed deck, and so they can keep their dog, Esther. She seems to sense our loss and is frequently showing up on our doorstep (she doesn't have to be enclosed when groups aren't in) and coming inside to hang out with us.
Thank you guys so much for your support and understanding. This has been such an emotional rollercoaster that I can't even describe it. Everytime I see his big doofy face I have to fight to keep from losing it. I just hope that all of this is for the best.
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I'm so sorry. I can hardly wait for you to have your house with your own hoard of "dangerous beasts". ;) Hang in there...
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My heart is breaking for you. This is tough and it really isnt fair- not that life has to be fair- but once in a while would be nice. Maybe you guys will be able to get your house and your property sooner rather than later. Please continue to join us here at BPO, we would miss you terribly if you were no longer a part of the group.
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Does Izzy still need a home? I will help any Newf I can. Write me at crys.kernan@gmail.com if I can be of any help. Let's get Izzy a forever home!