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BPO Legislation Forum => Bills & Other Legislative Acts => : Luvmydanes May 23, 2005, 10:38:03 AM
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I need advice. Not this past weekend, but the weekend before last, our landlords came over and wanted to "revise" our pet agreement. In that agreement was things that said the dogs had to be indoors at all times, except if they were out on a leash, and that they couldn't be over 15 pounds!!!
We revised the size and made them initial it, cause OBVIOUSLY our dogs are over that. Here is where I get angry. We left on Saturday to run to the pet store, we left Dane here. We were gone from 9:30-11:00. When we got here there was a note on our door saying that this was our 1st formal warning and that Dane did nothing but barked for an hour and a half. The landlord called my mom to find out where we were, saying she was annoyed with Dane and was just going to unlock our door and put him inside. I called my mom right as we were walking out the door at 9:20, talked for about 5 minutes, THEN had to load the kids in the car and go, so we left at about 9:30. She called my mom at 10:15 (gotta love the caller ID) so that isn't even an hour! She is saying he was barking for an hour and a half, and told my mom that when she called her. When we went over to talk to her when we got home, she told us she was going to call the pound cause she wanted to sleep in and Dane prevented her from doing that. Can she even do that? She also told us that after our 2nd complaint, they can "make us" remove Dane from the premises. We told her Dane is part of the family, so if he goes, we go. I HATE THEM!!! I have been so mad all weekend. Any advice would be appreciated. Sorry so long.
Kandi
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You had the right to refuse to revise the pet agreement until your lease was up. Why did you( initial it) sign it???
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Well, the animal shelter or "pound" definitely cannot do anything if the dogs are inside, well cared-for and in compliance with the modified lease - all of which your dogs are. However, the landlord/property owner probably can do something if she "feels" there is a problem. Check your local noise ordinances in your town. Around here, the dog (or other noise) has to be at a constant unpleasant level for an hour before law enforcement can cite the offender. I always say it's better to catch more flies with honey so I would try sitting down with the landlord (I assume you live in a duplex or apt. with shared walls) and letting her know how sorry you are that she was not able to sleep in because of Dane and that you are "horrified" that he had such bad behavior for the short time that you were gone. Let her know that you are looking into ways to address this behavior and if she could be sympathetic for a few weeks until you get him trained you would be very appreciative. Also , if she could help you by letting you know when and for how long he barks when you are gone it will help you be able to modify his behavior. This way, she becomes part of the solution instead part of the problem.
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I have sooooooooo many questions going through my head.
Do you have to rent or are you saving to own? Are you close to having enough to own?
Have you thought of talking to your land lord and finding out if the barking is the only problem?
Your land lords are very very sneaky, I don't like them AT ALL! I t sounds like you were being set -up for something bigger when asked to revise the pet policy.
Did you ask why they wanted to revise lease pet policy?
Did you contact the local authorities to find out what the ordinance on dog barking is.
Did you contact local authorities on you landlords sneaky tricks.
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We had the landlords inital it because they tried to put in there that we couldn't have a dog over 15 pounds. We actually live on 5 acres in the country and they have turned the garage into an apartment which is where they live. I know that legally if she were to open up my house and let dane inside, that would be against the law. They are not to do that without at least 24 hours written notice.
Kandi
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OMG WHY DID YOU REVISE THE AGREEMENT???????????
I HATE LANDLORDS FOR THE MOST PART
ALWAYS PUT IN WRITING THAT YOU CAN HAVE ANY SIZE DOG. IT HOLDS UP IN COURT. HOPEFULLY IT NEVER HAS TO GO THERE
YOU CAN PUT HIM UP ON CRUELTY TO ANIMAL CHARGES NO DOG SHOULD BE LEFT ONLY OUT DOORS
CALL ASAPA AND ANY OTHER SITE ON CRUELTY TO ANIMALS YOU CAN FIND
USUALLY IT SAYS, AS LONG AS THE DOG HAS A DOG HOUSE AND WATER, THATS IT
BUT IF YOUR DOG WAS RAISED INDOORS, IT WONT BE ABLE TO TOLLERATE THE COLD
AS FOR BARKING THE LAW ALOWS ,,, FROM 10 A.M TO 10 .P.M NOISE CONTROLL
IF YOU HAVE TOO,, DEPENDIN ON STATE, BUT THAT IS THE USUAL
A BARK COLAR MIGHT BE THE ANSWER THEY LEARN FAST, ONY A FEW SHORT JOLTS, AND YOU CAN TURN IT OFF AND DANE WILL KEEP WEARING IT THINKING
IT STILL WORKS OK DOGS ARE NOT ALL THAT BRIGHT AT TIMES
HOPE THIS ALL WORKS OUT FOR YOU
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wait. please clarify: was Dane inside or outside when this happened?
You had the landlords change the lease to accommodate the size of your dogs, right? I think people are misunderstandi ng that. The lease originally stated no dogs over 15 lbs., but you changed that and had them initial it to allow for your dogs. That's what I understood.
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Thank you. Dane comes inside usually around 4 or 5pm. I have 3 toddlers, and now a puppy, and Dane actually prefers being outside when it is nice out anyways. When the weather is bad, he is in all day, but if its nice, he loves the sun! I am just so annoyed. I didn't think they could really do anything about him barking, especially in the middle of the day, on our property, and he is enclosed, so it isn't like he is threatening to anyone or anything. Yes, it may be a little annoying, but I dont even know if he truely was barking. I think they are looking for an excuse to get us out of their house. Dane has NEVER barked for long periods of time - ever! We did buy him a bark collar, but he is a smart dog. The kind we have has 6 levels of correction, and then after that, for safety reasons, it shuts off. So Dane has figured out to endure the shocks until level 6 and then he can bark at anything he wants! Again, he usually only barks at strangers, or this dumb cat that runs around in "his" yard. He isn't a dog that just barks and barks and barks. We don't allow him to do that even if he wanted to.
Kandi
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OH MY MISUNDERSTANDI NG
IF YOU HAVE AN UPDATED LEASE
THE LANDLORD CANNOT DO A THING
HOPEFULLY IT IS NOT ABOUT TO EXPIRE
THEN YOU HAVE 6 MONTHS TO RELOCATE, UNLESS HE HAS SOLD THE HOME
ALSO IF HE MAKES YOUR LIFE MISERABLE , LEASE UP,
DONT PAY THE RENT
HE CANT EVICT YOU FOR 6 MONTHS
SEE HOW HE LIKES THAT
IT WILL PAY TO LOOSE YOUR , IF YOU HAVE, THE SECURITY NOT PAYING THE RENT
LET THE DOGS HAVE A BLAST IF YOU HAVE TO MOVE
SEE HOW MUCH IT WILL COST HIM TO "FIX" THE MESS LOL
OH WELL THE PLUMBING WENT SOME HOW ETC,,,,,,,
I THINK I AM VERY VINDICTIVE, BUT TO SEE SOME HAVE THIER HEART BREAK IS WORSE
THIS HAPPEND TO ME AS A CHILD, MY MOM COULD NOT AFORD TO MOVE I HAD TO GIVE UP MY LITTLE MIX BREED
HOW CAN ANYONE DO THIS TO A CHILD, EVEN AN ADULT
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gosh and gosh again >:( I have to agree with Jen, it sounds like a very nasty way of setting you up for something else, just to get rid of you. I dont know where you are located, and the laws and regulations vary depending on where you live. As I have said before on here, we rent out houses, and have had serious problems with the people who rented, even after them being behind with rent two months, we couldnt do anything but ring the doorbell and if they didnt open, well we were screwed, the only way we could get rid of him was if we went to court, sat there for several hours to wait on our turn (they have separate hearings when it comes to rent issues) then we would have filed a claim, the court would have ordered the guy to move out within 30 days and pay us, of course he wouldnt since he hadnt done so already, so then we would have had to file to get his employer to deduct a certain amount each week/month until the debt was payed off. We opted not to do all that. He did pay some, but by the time he moved out he owed us about $1000 in rent, and since we are suckers we let him move in without more than half the deposit, he had had a rough time and we felt sorry for him and wanted to give him a second chance, needless to say, he had made permanent changes to the house that took way more than the deposit to fix. But like "jj" said, at least try and talk to the landlord, ask what the real problem is and what you can do to make her feel okay with the situation. That was the one thing we said throughout the whole thing with our guy, had he only spoke to us, said "I am soooo broke, can we work on this" we had been more than willing to set up some kind of payment plan. So first of all I would go talk to her. If that doesnt help, and it may not, because I get the gutfeeling that she is up to something, since she all of a sudden came and wanted you to sign the revised agreement. How are your agreement, is it a years contract, where both you and the landlord have to give at least 30 days notice if a move is to happen?? And a certain amount of noice, you will have to put up with, no matter if you like dogs or not, there are children who make more noices than dogs. I know that here where we live, if you have problem with someone being real noicy, as long as you live in a house and not an apartment (dont know how it is with them) they say that, if the noice or partying, drinking or whatever it may be, as long as it is done on the property and not outside the property lines, and before 11 pm, there is absolutely nothing you can do, as long as there are no criminal actions going on. If you look into your cities regulation for noice, I am pretty sure you will find the same, they really do not want to mess with it, if it is not in the middle of the night or criminal. If she wants total quiet she should not have rented the place out, what if you had had kids, from experience I know how it can sound when the kids have friends over, a dog bark is nothing lol.....
This is I think the second issue we have had here with bad landlords, I hate it, it gives all landlords a rutten name, and that is a shame, there are good ones out there too. Where do you live kandi??? we have a house available for rent in a couple of weeks lol......
Marit
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Ok, here is what happened: We moved in, signed a lease. There was NO PET AGREEMENT! We did have to pay a pet deposit, but we signed nothing about anything that had to do with dogs when we moved in. 2 weekends ago, they came over, (they knew we were getting a puppy I think is why) with this "pet agreement". Make sense?
Kandi
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Okay just so I am sure I get it right (a bit slow lol...) when you first signed the contract where there a "no pet" part in that original contract. If so, did you have a verbal agreement when you got dane. Or did the "pet agreement" come up first now. or was it just changed from no pets, to what kind of pets you can have, how big and how they are to be kept?? Did you pay a pet deposit when you moved in, or now when you signed the revised contract.
Marit
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Marit - When we moved in, before we even bothered coming to look at this place, we had asked if pets were allowed, told her we had a great dane, and he was mostly an outside dog, depending on the weather. She said it was fine, we just had to pay a pet deposit. When we moved in, we signed the lease (which is up as of Aug. 1st) We signed some papers about the pet deposit, but nothing regarding "pet noises, keeping pets indoors only. etc, etc." They just brought all this up 2 weekends ago. We have lived here for 6 months now I think, and none of this has ever been a problem up until now. I really think that when they had us move in here, it was because her husband wasn't working and they needed the money, and now he has gauranteed work, so they want their house back basically, and are just looking for a reason to evict us. Thing is, if they evict us, we lose our entire deposit ($600 - we only had to pay $100 for the dog) I'm just so frustrated cause none of this was a problem before 2 weeks ago. I was pretty mad when she told me she was going to call the pound and have Dane taken away. I looked right at her and said "kind of like how we should have called the pound on your dog when it bit my 2 year old in his face." his face is still scared and he is deathly afraid of small dogs now. There was no pet contract up until this weekend. We just payed a deposit and moved in. No pet contract, only a lease.
Kandi
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First of all Kandi, she can NOT keep your deposit, even if she evicts you, the deposit is to be used solely for the purpose if the landlord had to do repair work, that is not regular wear and tear, say your dogs have peed all over carpets and can not be cleaned, well then if she has to change them that would be a reason to keep the deposit, but if there is just regular wear and tear in the house, no way she can keep the deposit. And if your lease is up in aug. well the normal thing to do for a landlord would have been to wait and do the changes they thought they wanted to do until then, now it defenately sounds like she is only looking for a way to get you out, stupid since your lease is up in just a couple of months anyway. But it does not sound like she has anything to stand on, when it comes to the noice, it takes way more than that for a landlord to be able to evict, at least here, and since you have a child, well here it is almost impossible to evict a family with children, they have to be real criminal, no judge wants a child to be homeless. I would call your city hall and ask them about the regulations for noice, then I would ask her to sit down and try and talk to her, ask why and what is the problem (but we probably already know that I think, she wants to move in there herself) But in a nice way let her know you have checked on the noice regulations for your area, and mention the dog bite from her little dog as a "goodwill" for you. Make sure she realizes that you know your rights and will not be pushed around without grounds. But if there is nothing other than wear and tear, she can NOT keep your deposit. I hope things turn out okay, but do not back down, I think it is just now a scare tactic from her side, and she probably hopes that you dont know your rights and that she can bully you around.
Marit
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Marit - that is exactly what it is. I think that she thinks we dont know our rights. We went out of town yesterday and were gone all day, and we took Dane with us, mostly because I seriously thought if he was barking she would 1.) get rid of him, call whoever she had to to get him out of here, or 2.) let him off his run, and since we live off of a busy street, he may get hit by a car, and they'd just act like they knew nothing. Its sad. I can't even leave my house anymore cause I'm afraid of not getting another notice, but what will happen to the love of my life. And because she has been such a b*tch about it, I now encourage dane to bark! lol...I know i'm bad, but it pisses me off. Don't tell me I CAN'T do something, cause I will do it, you know?
There is just normal everyday wear and tear. We have had some accidents with jasmine in the house, but no stains, they've all been cleaned up completely with carpet cleaner. Thank you for the info about the deposit. Shaun is under the impression that if we get evicted, we forfit our deposit. And I wasn't sure how it worked at all, but didn't sound right that they get to keep it. I will call and find out the noise ordinace laws for out here.
Kandi
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Good Luck, and let me know how things goes. But dont let her fool you. From experience I know just how hard it is to evict someone, and we do not try to be a pain in the butt for tiny things, only when people owe us bunches of money (its not like we dont have to pay our bills) or our last ones, who left a candle burning and left the house, so the fire department had to come, we had to gut that house out completely and it was totally renovated and they had only lived there for a month, thats when we dont like our renters lol..... Our last ones had two pits. that were barking constantly, but I am real good at closing my ears, hmmmm guess that comes with having three kids and bunches of pets. Good Luck again
Marit
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What a total creep! How could they do that to you? It sounds to me like they are looking for an excuse to move you and your big boys out. And for the record, if you could call the spca or cops on someone for having their excessive noise for 1/2 hour then my upstairs neighbor would be in prison! He has an alarm clock that is soooo loud and goes off for over an hour every day beginning at 5:00 a.m. It is the worst and no one seems to do anything- even when we have complained.
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Thanks to all. I guess its pretty much a waiting game. I know the next time we leave the house, whether its to go grocery shopping or to visit my parents, whatever, we'll come home to our "final notice" and they'll try to evict us. Which at that point I WILL stop paying rent!
Kandi
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Thanks Tina. Yes, we do have documentation on Caden being seen for her dog biting him, as well as pictures. I took them "just in case" I'm thinking I am so glad I did. I told her that we haven't been unreasonable, so I find it funny that she is acting this way over my dog barking when 1.) she knew we had a dog when we moved in, and 2.) her dog bit my child and I didn't even make her pay for the dr visit or anything. I am regretting that I didn't. Her dog should have been the one going to the pound. I dont be letting her keep the deposit after talking to you guys. I am going to be calling a number I found for people who know everything about landlord/tenant laws. Great idea on the tape recorder, we are actually going to set up our video camera so we can see if they do anything mean to Dane while we are gone.
Kandi
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Kandi - Just wanted to check on you and Dane...to see how things were going with your jacka** of a landlord. I've been thinking about you guys a lot and hope everything is going okay. The video camera is an excellent idea. I have a sneaking suspicion...as I think everyone else does....that they are B.S.ing this whole thing. If they have done anything to Dane, I have half a mind to come kick some butt myself...espec ially considering that their dog bit your son and they don't seem to care AT ALL. Please keep us informed. I hope everything is okay.
Hugs from NC,
Heather and Ranger
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Yes Kandi, if they are mean to Dane, I think you can count on the BPO's "convention" being held at your landlords place lol.... Well jokes apart, it is serious matter, if you have even the slightest suspicion (sp?) that they are doing something to dane, either as a "punishment" for him barking, or as a way of aggrevate him into doing something they could use against you, it is criminal, nothing less. So both the tape recorder and the video cam sounds like a real good idea. You are doing the right thing though, try and find out everything about your rights, and then confront them, let them know that you are not going to let them bully you, I totally agree with Heather that they are just hoping that they can use some kind of "scare/pressuring" tactic to get rid of you becasue they want to move in there themselves. Please let us know how things are going and keep a close eye on Dane, so nothing happens to that sweetheart.
Marit
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Thanks so much for checking up on me. :) It really does mean a lot. I have been busy. We are looking for a new place to move because I am sure it is a matter of time before we are evicted. We have to go grocery shopping this weekend, and I am sure once we all leave, we will come home to a note on our door. I am going to tape record though, to know if they are lying or not. I have been having a hard time with Dane and the puppy. Its hard juggling 2 dogs and 3 children (who are all 3 yrs and under) so its been a real task. Jasmine is really timid and its hard to train her cause she runs off. Im not sure if she is just not used to her surroundings yet, or what. Dane doesn't want to listen to anything either and that is frustrating. He's been acting kind of aggressive at times towards jasmine, and not sure why. Any suggestions? Again, thanks for the check up...I needed it! :)
Kandi
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Good luck in your search for a new house Kandi. When you say Dane has been aggressive, is it real aggression or the "stop that dumb puppy", I see on Hera here, that when Galahad is being too much, she tells him to cool it, she is real good with him has so much patience, he is hanging in her lips, tail, ears and steal every toy she gets. But sometimes she just wants to have som alone time, and then she can tell him to back off, if he is bothering her too much, and that is a good thing, he needs to be put in line, and know that he can not get away with just about anything with other dogs. So if that is what Dane is doing he is just being a good big brother, mind you if he is being too rough and you can tell that he is getting aggressive for real, not just telling Jasmine off, you probably want to monitor them quite closely.
Dane not lisening, can be a reaction to the change in the home with Jasmine there. But it could also be a reaction to how things are now, they are soooo good at feeling if the situation is not "right" if you and your husband are worried, unhappy and frustrated over the situation with the landlord you may send out those signals and they feels it, and get just like kids when they sense something is wrong, go all bad behaved on you. Jasmine has not been with you for very long, so she may still be settling in, when you train her do you have Dane there too, or do you get her somewhere, where she can be alone, if not that may be a good idea until she feels a little more sure of herself.
And do I have the greatest respect for you or what........ three kids all under 3, ouch....... I have mine spread out and still think they are way too many sometimes lol....
Marit
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Marit - Thanks for the words of wisdom. Its just been one of those days you know? Just enough is enough. Dane hasn't been real bad, we went away on a trip on Sunday and took the dogs with us and we stopped for lunch and brought out a food dish, and Dane smelled it and walked off, well when Jaz started eating, he ran over and growled at her. I just didn't like that. We put him back in the van as "punishment". Other than that its mostly him pawing her, but I think that is his way of saying "hey, I'm the top dog here...not you" I think Dane definately senses something is off. We are both really stressed about this whole thing. Sounds stupid, but it is to the point where just to not think about it I have been sleeping alot. I got to bed early, take naps with the kids, its just getting out of hand. And Shaun and I have been fighting as well. And I know this is all because of the dumb landlords. Then the breaking point, today Dane was out on his run and him and Jasmine were playing in the yard, and he chewed through the pulley! So I have a puppy, who doesn't listen, and a 1405-150 lb dog that doesn't listen cause she isn't listening running around the yard with a busy road right next to us! UGH!!!! I finally got her in the house in her kennel for a while and managed to work something out with Dane until Shaun gets home from work tonight. We built corral type thing, but just need to get a fence put up, then Dane can have free roam of it, so we will be having to do that this weekend. I'm sorry...this turned more into a vent than anything. :)
Kandi
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Vent away! That's what friends are for anyhow! I'm sorry you are having one of those days :-\ I get those often and when I do I tend to cry out of frusteration. I hate that about myself, but Leo always picks up on it and tries to comfort me. Last week I threw myself on my bed and bawled and Leo came over and put his chin on the end of the bed and whined. It made me cry harder and that made him bark at me which he only does when I put my coat on. It just goes to show you that dogs pick up on your feelings and that's probably what Dane is doing. You've got a lot on your plate and I can empathize with you. I gave birth to three kids in 30 months, but it gets easier and it will for you too! Keep your chin up and try to stay possitive ;)
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thanks guys. It really makes my day to know I can come here and get support when I need it. You guys are the best. :) I agree...I think I will get some booze this weekend, and "enjoy" hubby. LOL. That could be another part of the problem. Its been over a week now!! Geez! And everyone knows, it is such a tension realease...Gue ss who is going to bed early tonight?? LOL.....I think it is Dane just letting Jazzy know who is boss, I just have never seen him act this way before so it is kind of un-nerving. He has never been like that, so I didn't expect it I guess. She tries to paw him too, but it doesn't work to well for her. ;D Anyways, Thanks again guys
Kandi