Author Topic: Berner puppy size  (Read 37560 times)

Offline MarleyPyr

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Berner puppy size
« on: September 11, 2008, 11:53:32 am »
Hey Berner owners.... as the proud owner of my first berner I am noticing some major differences from my pyr which is cool to experience. One of the things I am curious about is the size. I know they are large breeds - not as large as the pyr's however my girl is MUCH smaller at 5 months than my pyr...like half the size.
Is this typical? what is the average growth rate of the berners? What size are some of the other berner babies out there that are on this site?
thanks.
Carolyn
1 Great Pyr 2yrs
1 Berner pup

Casselman,Ontario
Canada

Offline sc.trojans

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2008, 04:45:12 pm »

Berners can vary greatly in size.  Given that I am in Rescue and see a lot of backyard bred dogs, I see many that are no where near the breed standard and have no bone, looking more like Golden Retrievers.  In this breed, it comes down to how much "bone" they have - if they are slight in build, they will weigh less.  Heavy structure, more.  And then again, if they are simply long on leg (leggy) they can weigh more as well.

So the easiest way to determine is to know her parents' size.  How big is mom and dad? 

If you don't know them, then go back to 8 weeks of age (if you had her then) and tell us what she weighed.  At 8 weeks of age, a good average weight for a Berner  pup within the breed standard is 15 lbs for a female. So if a pup starts here, then at 12 weeks she'll be 23-24 lbs.  Usually there is a growth spurt at about 4-5 months, so it is hard to say. My girl, who is large for a female, weighed 40 lbs. at 16 weeks and I see this as the high end - a girl should never be bigger than mine :)  As a grown adult, my girl weighs 94-95 lbs.  Her mom weighs the same, and her dad was 120 lbs.

Hope that helps....
SC Trojans
with Gracie and Skylar

Offline MarleyPyr

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2008, 04:58:55 pm »
hmm ok well weight wise she seems on target. She is just over 5 months and about 46lbs. She is filling out in her body but doesn't seem to be growing in her height. Maybe she will just be a late bloomer as far as height? she is looking a little stunted right now  ;)

We had the opportunity to see the mom and she was about the size of a large lab. Apparently the dad was bigger.

Carolyn
1 Great Pyr 2yrs
1 Berner pup

Casselman,Ontario
Canada

Offline SadieA

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2008, 03:12:09 pm »
Well, this may not be super helpful as Sammy is a male, but I can tell you that from my experience with him, size as a pup does not necessarily predict size at full-grown. Sammy is just a year and three months, so he may have a bit more growing to do, but all the same... he was 20 lbs when I got him at eight weeks, which I believe to be fairly large for a pup, and at 6 months he was around 65, but now he's only 85, and has been that size for a good five months. So he way still get bigger, but it seems unlikely he's really going to be a big berner- I'd be quite surprised if he ends up at more than 100 pounds. His dad was about 100, so I'd imagine he may be around the same, which is fairly small for a male, despite his large size as a pup. He was from a small litter, though, so maybe that accounts for the size as a pup...

Offline sc.trojans

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2008, 06:40:09 pm »
His dad was about 100, so I'd imagine he may be around the same, which is fairly small for a male, despite his large size as a pup.

Actually Sadie....100 lbs is not small in the breed - it is dead on average and appropriate. Males should be 100-120 lbs. ideally.  Any more and they are not a "large" breed dog, but a "giant" breed and that isn't a Berner.  Females are 80-95 lbs. and also should not be any more than this.  It is commonly referred to as "over done" in the breed - not desirable, so take heart.

Your boy sounds small however - probably lacking bone and this most likely explains the lower weight.  His growth plates should be closed about now, so height should largely be finished...but he will do A LOT of filling out still up to 4 years of age.  You will see a different dog in chest width etc. at 3 years old vs. today but not much weight variation.
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Offline SadieA

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2008, 01:22:06 am »
SC Trojans, thanks for the input! I wouldn't actually say Sammy is lacking bone- he's quite solid, built MUCH more solidly than the goldens I grew up with. People see him, and they say "That's a BIG dog." I think the reason he's a bit lighter than many Berners is that he isn't particularly tall. His shoulder is a bit above my knee, but not much (I'm 5'10") and his head is just at the level that I can reach down and pet him with my arm fully extended without having to bend down. His frame is built heavily, but I keep him pretty slim and he's not particularly tall.

I've attached a picture of him that was taken way back in March- he is the same size now, only looks a little slimmer as he's shed out quite a bit!

Offline SadieA

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2008, 01:25:24 am »
just realized I already had that pic up as my avatar pic... whoops. But I guess you can see it a little bigger in the attachment!

Offline Mainebernese

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2008, 02:44:43 am »
Our male Berner was 58 lbs when we took him to the vet to be neutered at 6 months old.  He is now just 2 weeks shy of being a year old and weighs 102 lbs.  He is all leg though...one of the tallest berners I have seen in person, but he is pretty skinny otherwise.  And I must say, one of the pickest eaters I know too!  Anyone ever had a dog that would prefer a carrot or lettuce over a hotdog??!!!
Kaitlen

Cooper ~ 1 year old Bernese Mountain Dog
Coda (aka ruler of the household) ~ 5 year old, chubby grumpy, male cat
Ava (sister to the ruler) ~ 5 year old petite angel, female cat

Offline MarleyPyr

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2008, 11:19:29 am »
Maybe Jasmin will still have a growth spurt. She is filling in well I just find her really short??
One thing I also notice is she pants a LOT. Like unless she is sleeping...she is panting? Common? - My Pyr isn't like this at all.
Carolyn
1 Great Pyr 2yrs
1 Berner pup

Casselman,Ontario
Canada

Offline sc.trojans

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2008, 05:32:49 pm »

There is usually a second growth spurt at about 9-10 months of age in the breed - so you're far from done, rest assured.

it is impossible to judge your pup without seeing her, but keep in mind that females are to be 23" - 26" in height at the withers - when full grown.  So even if she is on the low end of the standard, that will likely feel quite short to you given what you are accustomed to (giant breed).
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Offline Mainebernese

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2008, 11:11:28 pm »
Cooper pants a lot too.  I thought it was the heat, but it is starting to cool down...I am hoping by the time snow flies he will be panting less! 
Kaitlen

Cooper ~ 1 year old Bernese Mountain Dog
Coda (aka ruler of the household) ~ 5 year old, chubby grumpy, male cat
Ava (sister to the ruler) ~ 5 year old petite angel, female cat

Offline sc.trojans

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2008, 10:14:44 am »

Sorry...forgot to respond to the panting.

Panting should not be ignored and "can" be a serious sign of a problem....or not.

Heat is the obvious factor and heat in Berners is metabolic - has nothing to do with the amount of coat they have.  My current Berner has less coat than any other and she is my "hottest" dog.

Panting can also be a respiratory issue - summer allergies causing nasal congestion will necessitate breathing through the mouth harder to get air, if the dog can't breath the nose.  You should be able to ascertain this however to determine if this is the issue.  I see this as the issue most often.

Panting is often a sign of stomach distress - GI Tract issues including gas, bloating, cramping will cause a dog to pant heavily and fast.  Diet is the issue here, and you should evaluate patterns of the panting to see if this is the issue - after meals, later at night etc. You can try giving Gasalia (Boiron) or Bio 92 (Reckeweg) and see if that helps as well.  This is also very common and overlooked by owners.

Panting is a sign of stress of course - owners can determine this on their own.

Finally, panting is also a symptom of other internal discomfort - for a variety of reasons from muscle/tendon injury to cancer/lymphoma.

So please don't disregard....d etermine the cause.


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Offline Mainebernese

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2008, 11:19:24 am »
Thank you for this information... I will definitely pay very close attention to the time periods when he is panting! 
Kaitlen

Cooper ~ 1 year old Bernese Mountain Dog
Coda (aka ruler of the household) ~ 5 year old, chubby grumpy, male cat
Ava (sister to the ruler) ~ 5 year old petite angel, female cat

Offline MarleyPyr

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Re: Berner puppy size
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2008, 11:38:25 am »
Thank you for the expertise. Very good info. I will have to determine if there are certain time the panting seems worse. I sort of thought at first it was excitement but I am going to pay close attention to the patterns.
 :)
Carolyn
1 Great Pyr 2yrs
1 Berner pup

Casselman,Ontario
Canada